Success Stories

Relationship Marketing With Kody B: Jay McHugh

On this week’s episode of Kody Bateman’s Relationship Marketing Podcast, Kody’s guest is Jay McHugh,  Co-Owner and CAO at LAER Realty Partners and author of “How to Sell Your Home for More Money”.

Jay has over 30 years experience as a Realtor assisting over 1000 families in the Greater Boston area serving on many boards and volunteer groups throughout the years. Jay coaches and trains his own and other Realtors on how to 10x their business with Appreciation.

His favorite training starts with a quote: “It’s not the cost of sending the cards that is expensive; it is the cost of not sending the cards that is expensive”  Jay McHugh.

Kody Bateman: Hey everybody. This is Kody Bateman. Welcome to a brand new edition of our Relationship Marketing Podcast Show. Very, very excited for our guest today. Of course I’m excited every single week. We’ve had some amazing line-up of guests last week. So I’m probably going to say that every single time I start this podcast.


But I will tell you, the guy that I’ve got on today, I actually know very well, know him a lot better than maybe some of my other guests that I’ve had and this guy is a product of the product. He walks the talk. I mean he – everything that he’s going to share today, he’s a very strong advocate. He’s an in-the-trenches kind of guy. He’s out there building business every single day and he utilizes these techniques every single day in building a business.


I love interviewing people that are actively involved in the sales process. You know, a lot of people go on to be trainers and stuff like that, which is great and we have – we’ve had some incredible trainers on this show and previous shows. The guy today man, he is one of those trainers but he is in the trenches every single day implementing the techniques he’s going to share with you today.


I just want to introduce this guy. Man, I’m excited. I’ve been waiting a long time to get you on here today. This is Jay McHugh. Jay, welcome to the podcast here.


Jay McHugh: Thanks Kody. Thanks for having me.


Kody Bateman: Now Jay is based out of Massachusetts. Let me tell you a little bit about this guy. This is no small time guy here. There have been some big, big accomplishments in the real estate industry. Jay McHugh is the chief appreciation officer, which by the way first of all, I love that title. So that would be CAO, the CAO, chief appreciation officer and owner, co-owner of LAER Realty Partners. He’s actually owners with his wife Stacey Alcorn and Jay McHugh. They own – LAER Realty owns 28 offices with 476 agents and he has been using some service since 2008 that has really had a profound effect on his business and I’m sure he’s going to talk to us about that today.


So let’s just get started. So this – we’re talking big business. So you’re a real estate broker, right?


Jay McHugh: Correct.


Kody Bateman: And you have 476 agents. I mean how do you grow something to this size? I mean this is big time business.


Jay McHugh: The main word that comes to my head is “systems”. You put systems in place. Everything – all the chaos, all the noise is removed and when you have great systems, you can then work those systems any which way you need to enhance them. So we have great staff. We have systems. We have a playbook. We have an onboarding team and it just becomes systemized.


Then of course my wife Stacey does a great job with her systems. I do a great job with my systems. If we didn’t have the systems, it will be a lot of chaos and you wouldn’t be able to have the growth that we’re experiencing.


Kody Bateman: So how did you get started? I mean how did you start the whole real estate career? Walk us through that.


Jay McHugh: Sure. I was always an entrepreneur by nature. I was selling – you know, the Boston Globe when I was eight years of age when everybody was sleeping late. I was cutting lawns when everybody else was going to the movies. I was taking an extra class to become a bartender when people were going on spring break. I just knew it in myself that if you put the time and energy and effort upfront, then you will have those financial gains where the people seem to be behind the – just behind everybody else and during the recession of the late ‘80s, I wanted to become a criminal defense attorney that could see the challenge that a lot of attorneys were out of work.


But I wanted to do something entrepreneurial sooner than later and that brought me into the real estate space. In the real estate space, it was a tough year. It was a tough [0:04:06] [Indiscernible]. I read a book. I used the book that said a few tips. I spent and invested money on a three-ply brochure when everybody had a business card and I started to get those results that everybody was afraid to spend money and that’s really what opened up my mind is that when people are zigging, you need to zag.


When people are afraid to invest, you need to invest and that just springboarded me into success in my first full year of selling real estate.


Kody Bateman: Wow. Yeah. So a great start. Grassroots starting, entrepreneurial-spirited even when you were a kid. I find a lot of times – you know, I’ve got similar experiences. When I was a kid growing up, I started a landscaping business and my dad had a tractor. He had an old green John Deere tractor that had a – it had a tiller on the back and a frontload around the front and I learned how to use that when I was like 13, 14 years old.


So at the age of 15, I started a landscaping business and I took that tractor around and helped people put in their yards and stuff. But I will tell you, that’s – honestly that’s some of the best training – I mean I look at my college days. I look at all this stuff I’ve done in my career and I go back to those original – when you were a kid kind of stuff, it really kind of instilled things in you. So kind of cool to see that.


To see your success since then has just been phenomenal Jay and you’re the kind of guy – you kind of magnetize people. When Jay walks in a room, people kind of magnetize to Jay. He has got a ton of energy, got that Boston accent, if that is such a thing. But to me, living out in the West, I love listening to you speak. I’m not sure about the whole New England patriot fan thing but other than that, we think you’re OK. So – by the way, the patriots – yeah. Hopefully they will do well this weekend. So at least as far as you go.


I don’t know about me. I might be rooting for the other guys. But anyway, well, let’s talk a little bit about LAER realtor. Like I said 476 agents, 28 offices, over a billion dollar in sales. I mean just incredible stuff that you’re doing. You call yourself the chief appreciation officer. Why do you call yourself that?


Jay McHugh: Well, you’ve helped me a lot with all your training and all your books. Promptings was one of the best books that I ever read because it acted on the promptings that we need to give and to be mindful of when something great happens. Why do we have to wait? I love what you said because I come from a big Irish family and you said, you know, most Irish people are crying at the wake and funeral because they didn’t tell someone that they loved them while they were living.


You know, it happened to me and therefore teaching how to appreciate people has become very easy for me and to me. When I see it in the real estate space – unfortunately I see a lot of real estate agents again focusing on the money, not focusing on the best practices and therefore they wait to say thank you or “I appreciate you,” or even send a gift until the end of the transaction and I say, “Wow, you’re really missing out on a huge opportunity to say thank you on the first initial meeting, thank you at the time of the offer being accepted, thank you at the home inspection, good, better and different, thank you at the mortgage commitment. Congratulations. We’re almost at the finish line.”


You know, I’ve been training this for a few three, four years and I’ve seen great results for myself and the people who are listening to me. But there’s still 80 percent that say, “Nah. What happens if it doesn’t sell, Jay? Why would you spend money on that if it didn’t sell or they didn’t buy and they went with somebody else?”


Well, they’re thinking in the negative. They’re thinking in the scarcity instead of the abundance. You’re more likely to get a great referral during the process if you say thank you more and more often than after the home is sold because guess what, the buyers and sellers, they don’t really care about real estate anymore and they don’t care about referring business.


So I’ve taken that one little aspect and have really grown my personal business and my company’s business and the challenge is with your help and everybody else in our SendOutCards community is to get that through to many of my agents that are still stuck in the mud with those old ways. But that excites me. Every single day I have a great job, which is to help people see the light in a different light than it was 20, 30 years ago and that’s what keeps me going.


Kody Bateman: OK. So you mentioned there – a lot of our listeners don’t know what SendOutCards is. You mentioned SendOutCards is a service that you use to get these thank-yous out. By the way, I want to come back to that because I want to talk about the philosophy of thanking through the process, which is what you just mentioned.


But tell us a little bit about SendOutCards and why – you know, how you were introduced to it and why you use it. In fact I think – you know, it’s probably one of the biggest tools that you use to build your business today. You can speak to that. But just tell us how all that started with using that service.


Jay McHugh: That is a great question Kody and there are some great trainer out there in our real estate space that taught and still teach the handwritten note card and I loved it and I use it now to show as an example, that that is like AOL. That is like a Commodore 64. That’s like dial-up web service.


Today we have Google. Today we have the Wi-Fi. Today we have SendOutCards and therefore if someone – if you look at my office, if I can do this – I’m not sure if we’re on a web camera or not. But if you looked at my office, you will see nearly 300 of my SendOutCards cards that I’ve received, that I have not thrown out. Yet I don’t have two personal handwritten cards that I’ve received over 30 years of selling real estate because one, I can’t read their chicken scratch writing and secondly, it doesn’t move the needle.


What SendOutCards has shown me with your help and all the teachings that I study and like – I love to consume good information – is that when you can send a card and say thank you, unsolicited, with nothing else attached and that I appreciate you, they’re more likely going to keep that card and be memorable to you and your team and your service and therefore you’re sending a better quality card, a better touch, a better remembrance and for me, I think it’s shooting fish in a barrel, my friend.


I think you’re amazing for coming up, you and Jodi, your team, and then you added the speed of SendOutCards with a good Wi-Fi connection. I literally had a prompting this morning. I get up at 3:30, 4 o’clock and somebody said something nice over Facebook. I took 33 seconds to send them out a genuine awesome card from your system and that was I know the system well, I know the image I wanted to use. I clicked, I clicked, I confirmed. I knew their address. They were already in the system and I sent it out. That’s 3:30 in the morning and I tell people, “Guys, I’m sending out between 15 and 20 cards a day,” and some of you are struggling to send out one, two, three cards a month.


If you use the system of SendOutCards and you master it, now with the great iPhone connection, the Android connection, an iPad and a Mac Pro and a PC, there’s no reason why people should not be using it because we have graduated. I tell people all the time. Sometimes my comments can be a little curt. I said you’re sitting at the children’s table or you’re sitting at the adult table. You’re either an amateur or you morphed into being a professional and again I love teaching this. I think it’s just right off the top of my head because not only am I doing it, I’m seeing incredible results, incredible results.


Kody Bateman: So we teach a concept called the “heartfelt card send”. SendOutCards started out on the premise of helping people to act on their promptings, to reach out in kindness. So if you have a thought that somebody needs to be thanked for something, you reach out and you say thank you or they need to – you know, job well done or whatever it is. That’s a prompting that should be acted upon and you act upon it. We have a system called SendOutCards. It gives you a way to send a real tangible greeting card. We call that – acting on a prompting, we call that a heartfelt card send.


What we mean by that is that you – just like the story you just said, you got up at 4:30 and wanted to thank somebody that did something on Facebook. That’s a perfect example of heartfelt card send because you actually personalized it with probably a picture of them from Facebook and typed it in a personalized message and then send it out.


A lot of people today in marketing in particular – like you said, you even started out saying you got to have systems and to run a business, you got to have systems. Well, when people get into their marketing mind, they think systems too and there are a lot of great marketing systems out there.


But when it comes to sharing appreciation, people automatically go to their – even in sharing appreciation saying, “Well, I just need a system that will do it for me. It will just pop out an automatic card with an automatic message in it and the more of those I get out, the more business I’m going to get.”


Talk to us about the importance of heart – what is the difference between heartfelt and a systemized appreciation?


Jay McHugh: I love that question Kody because people ask me all the time about campaigns and “Do you have a virtual assistant to do this Jay?” and I say frankly, no. I say if – as an example, you brought up Tom Brady.


Tom Brady is playing this weekend. If there was a birthday the day after and I said, “Hey, congratulations. Happy birthday. Continue your success. Wasn’t that a great game yesterday by Tom Brady?” if they win, well that’s saying happy birthday, referencing something that that local friend of mine was pretty in tuned with and that card is going to be heartfelt and memorialized in a positive way than if it just said “Happy birthday. Happy belated birthday! Think of me every time you’re thinking about selling real estate.”


That’s where a lot of people fail with their card sending is that they don’t take the time to understand that if you can resonate a message that’s going to 10X the person who’s receiving it, you will 10X your business of VCP, visibility, credibility, weekly profitability and that’s what the magic is, is understanding systems and understanding what to say, when to say it, how to say it and doing what you and I do all the time.


Whenever you talk to me, you always put a smile on my face. You always make a quick reference to my Boston accent, my Irish accent and I appreciate that as opposed to if it was a very stale, generic conference call, Zoom call, whatever the case may be. Maybe just a number.


But when you have that connection because of your heartfelt interest with me and my daughter Oshyn, my wife Stacey, my business here in New England, referencing what you love to do, which I will do sports, referencing what I like to do which is passionate and helping people and therefore we’re connecting better than a generic trainer who’s just giving you numbers.


I have this quote I think I’ve told you before but I love it. I’m going to say it again slowly because I speak fast. People count, numbers don’t. When you focus on people, you will have an infinite amount of business.


When you focus on numbers, you will what I say create cement shoes and fall into proverbial bankruptcy.


Kody Bateman: Wow.


Jay McHugh: And I believe strongly from my witnessing of my own agents and peers and ancillary business folks is that the first question Kody is, “How much does it cost?” Some of them would then say, “What’s the return on the investment?”


Kody Bateman: Right, exactly.


Jay McHugh: You’re just not a candidate to work with me then and bye-bye.


Kody Bateman: You know, it’s interesting because it really is hard to teach that concept. You know, business minds automatically go to those phrases. You know, what’s the investment? What’s the ROI? Again, one of the things that we teach in our stuff and you teach this as well is there’s a – there’s kind of a formula. So the good old 80-20 rule and the 80-20 rule works in relationship marketing just like it works everywhere else.


The 80-20 rule says this is that 80 percent of the time, you should be creating relationship only. Only creating relationship, which means – and that could be in a greeting card. It could be in a phone call. It could be in a text. It could be whatever. Whatever the system of communication is, it doesn’t matter. Eighty percent of the time, you should be building nothing but relationship. Not asking for anything in return or anything. It’s just building relationship.


Then 20 percent of the time, you sprinkle in marketing. You sprinkle in stuff that you’re doing and what not. You’re a – I mean you live by that. I mean you do a really, really good job of that and I think it’s important that we teach that concept all the time that you really need to – in fact a lot of people say it really should be even more, maybe 90 percent relationship and 10 percent marketing.


I really think 80-20 is good and you’re really good at 80-20 even in your real estate business. You’re a master at creating relationships and you and I were talking on the phone the other night. You’re a master at creating relationship but you’re also really good on the marketing side. Like the 20 percent marketing, you take seriously even with the greeting cards.


Like you do things with your greeting cards in your real estate business that are for the 20 percent marketing. I want you to talk to that. But again, like I’m sure you will, come back to the importance of the 80 percent because that’s by far the most important. But you’re brilliant at the 20 percent side. So talk to us a little bit about that.


Jay McHugh: I appreciate those kind words. For the real estate agents, professionals, mortgage loan, et cetera, every time we’re going into a business situation, guess what, you’re competing against some form of competition. In the real estate space, we have this big juggernaut called Zillow and mortgage people have this big juggernaut called Quicken Loans and you got to recognize that again, they’re going to select a person. But how can you make them want to select you? You need to give them something different.


So I have one of my great students who has created this awesome card. Can I say it Kody? I will. It’s less than two bucks, right? Why wouldn’t somebody send this card to themselves and then in the marketing – you’re obtaining the listing or trying to earn the listing. You pull it out and you say, “Mr. and Mrs. Jones, this is an example of the type of card I will be sending. Mr. and Mrs. Jones, as you may or may not know, today 95 percent of all home sales are being co-broke with another agent, which means most agents are going to try to market to find that five percent of those buyers where I will be marketing to the agents that sell homes in the $2 million price points here in the greater Boston area. That is the difference between me and my competition.”


Now I’ve used an awesome piece of material, marketing material that you helped me create. I’ve spoken to their heart because I’m teaching them that frankly the numbers count here, that 95 percent of these home sales are going to be co-broke with another agent. It makes sense that a great listing agent like myself market to the agents that are most likely going to bring – this transaction and few people get it.


Kody Bateman: Yeah.


Jay McHugh: It’s like there you go. There’s the gold and here’s what I love telling people about it. There’s no minimal quantity. You can have me print one, ten, a hundred. You go to a local print shop. A guy – this quality card, they don’t look for a minimum of 100. You’re going to have to put an investment of $600 and then you keep them of course but it’s not specific to that particular audience when you go to meet with that client. So anyway, I could bore you with all these real estate tips.


Kody Bateman: Let’s go back real quick. I want you to put that card up and we’re going to try to describe it to those who are listening to the audio side of this. Those who watch this on YouTube, you can actually see this. But this – what Jay is holding up is a – it’s one of our big cards. So this is a big card and part of the purpose of the big card is for people to be able to do marketing touches with it.


So if you could just describe what’s on the card and who you send it to and when you send it to them.


Jay McHugh: So as an example, I have the floor plan on the back of the card. On the inside of the card, I have unbelievable high resolution pictures which on this paper just shouts out professionalism. Then I have – and I could create something on this particular one. It’s the typical MLS, Multiple Listing Service information, approximate living size, price, size of the rooms, garage spaces, heating, et cetera.


Then on the front is a beautiful picture with the information of the community, the schools, the property features and the home information again now with the remarks.


Kody Bateman: OK. So who are you sending that to?


Jay McHugh: So this is great. So the couple of audiences you can send it to. For instance, why not send it to the people who are living within a quarter of a mile who know this property? I always will put on the card, “Wouldn’t it be nice to pick your neighbor? Launching this particular home on February 1st, 2019. Please share this and head over to our specific link” That’s one example.


Another one would be to scrub the top agents who are selling these $2 million homes. Import them into your database and send out a card. Here Jay, wanted to share with you a new listing that we’re going to be launching February 1st. I’m sure you will see it on MLS but this is a great reminder to keep it with you at all times. Hope to do business with you here in 2019.


Kody Bateman: OK. So chances are that person – you may not know that person yet at all. I mean you – you got a listing of people that are listing these homes. You’re sending out those people. So this first touch may be a marketing touch. Sometimes people get mixed up with our 80-20 rule. They’re thinking, “Well, I got to create relationships for 80 percent of the time before I reach out to the market.” No, you can reach out to the market at any time you want.


It’s just once you get that person in your pipeline – because there’s going to come a point where whoever you send that to, somebody is going to respond to it. Once they respond to it, now you’ve got a connection that you can begin.


So this is an example of you using SendOutCards literally as a marketing tool to send a unique piece out. It’s a large style greeting card, full color. You can do all the stuff that you just explained to us, send it out to that multi-listing person and for the purpose of creating a new context to somebody you might do business with. Once they reach out to you, then what do you do? Once they reach out to you and say, “Yeah, I’m interested in maybe working with you,” then they’re in your pipeline now. Now, what do you do with that person?


Jay McHugh: Well, that’s gold and in the space of real estate is I’m going to either list their home or I’m going to sign them up for a buyer contract. Now I know I’m going to get paid and then of course if they are a client of mine, I’m going to continue to reap the benefits of appreciating them with our gifts, our books, our brownies, our things that are going to say, “Wow!” See, I love telling this to people Kody. I think this is really important.


For people in our BNI, I love our BNI educational system. People do not refer average. What people do is they nod their head and they say, “Yes, Jay. I will refer you,” and inside they’re saying, “I would never refer Jay but I don’t want to tell him. I don’t want to tell him.”


What happens is that most people are running around saying, “Oh, I’ve got a pipeline of people that are referring me. I’m waiting for the spring market to break, Jay.” Like you don’t have anybody because nobody refers. I use this example. I don’t say, “Hey Kody and Jodi, listen.” Here I have a little scenario. I got a great restaurant that has an average steak with an average price with an average setting and you’re going to pick the average bill. I say, “Kody and Jodi, I don’t know anything in Littleton.”


Conversely, Kody and Jodi for your anniversary, I got this great place called the Great Road Kitchen here in Littleton. The owners are friends of mine. I’m going to set you up. I’m going to pick up the tab and you’re going to enjoy this experience. You know why? Because I’m willing to refer Doug Shaw’s great restaurant to you and Jodi. But I wouldn’t put my neck out for an average restaurant.


Kody Bateman: Right.


Jay McHugh: That’s when people get stuck. When they went around saying, “I’m working so hard for referrals, Jay. What’s the problem?” I’m saying you’re average. You’re showing that you’re average. You’re not doing anything differently to become extraordinary. The difference between extraordinary and ordinary is the little extra things that the extraordinary will do that the ordinary will not do. As simple as that.


Kody Bateman: OK. So let’s go back. I want to tie back to something you said early in the call where you talk about thanking people through the process. You said you –


Jay McHugh: Sorry?


Kody Bateman: You mentioned a whole bunch of things. In fact, do that again. In the real estate process, you mentioned four or five times that you actually send a thank you type of message out. What are those touches?


Jay McHugh: We will use as an example a buyer. A buyer comes referred to me or I pick up a buyer through any kind of source, any kind of lead service. The minute I speak to them, the minute I meet with them, a card goes out saying, “Thanks very much for the opportunity to speak with you. Enclosed please some – find some brownies. It was a treat speaking to you or meeting you here at my office.”


Wow. I made them comfortable. Now we go out and we find a house. We put the house under agreement. We send a card and another gift. Hey, congratulations. The key to my success are great referrals like yourself. Pretty soon we will be getting a set of keys for your beautiful new home. Congratulations.


Wow. I’m using NLP, neuro-linguistic programming, in my messaging. Now upon the home inspection, guys, we got through a tough home inspection. We negotiated some difficult things but I’m on your side. We’re one step closer. Another card, another gift goes out. Wow.


They’re thanking me on Facebook. They’re thanking me on LinkedIn. They’re thanking me on Twitter. They’re thanking me by personal message. Now I’m increasing the chances of what? A great testimonial on one of the major platforms, right? Awesome stuff.


I’m increasing the chances that they will refer me to their friends and family. Hey, I heard you bought a house. Oh, geez, not only did we buy a house. Jay got us $5000 off of the home inspection. He’s amazing. You got to use him.


Now you get to the loan process. You’re working with your loan professional. Loan professional said, “Jay, we got the commitment. Everything is in good order. We can close sooner or later.” Another card, another gift goes out. Another card and gift go out to the loan officer who you referred them to, which I hope they come into my system because guys, you should be thanking me. But that’s another story.


Now two weeks before the closing, you could show up at the closing in a bikini. You don’t have to show up at the closing. They love you so much that you’re not doing the things that the traditional agent used to do, which was a waste of time.


You found them a house. You worked through the whole process. You made them comfortable. You took that trepidation away and they’re excited and they are buying a house and they’re referring you for a lifetime. Positive, awesome stuff.


Kody Bateman: OK. So for all of our listeners, that’s how you build 28 offices and 476 agents. I mean that’s the passion we’re talking about. Now, a lot of people Jay, they listen to you say this and we’ve talked about this kind of process in a lot of shows. I love the way that you shared it because you gave specific examples through the real estate process and what you do. It seems like a lot. I mean there are multiple thank-you and thank-you/gifts that go out and not only multiple that go to one person, but there are multiple people through the process.


Most of those that you send are heartfelt. Are they not mostly? I mean you do them one at a time, right? I mean it’s not a system doing it. You’re actually one at a time doing that process. So a lot of people listening right now or watching right now are saying, “My gosh, that sounds awesome. But how in the world am I ever going to have the time or the money to do that?” What do you say to these people?


Jay McHugh: Hey guys, when we started to ride a bike, we skinned our knees out a few times. When you wanted to be a black belter in karate, you had to fail more than you succeeded. Guys, if you want to run your business and you want to be a professional, not an amateur, star listening and start executing.


One of the favorite quotes I had when I went to my first seminar or I should say convention with you Kody, “Imagination without implementation is truly hallucination.” Therefore folks, if you want to grow your business, you cannot complain because once you get through this first one, the second one, once you start practicing to send out two heartfelt cards a day, it becomes easier to send out four. It becomes easier to send out five.


Once you start practicing, the first time you meet with a buyer and you send out a card and a brownie and you get a great testimonial on Facebook, you’re going to ask yourself, “Why have I not been doing this?” and it’s OK. Just let’s not focus on why you haven’t. Let’s just start now going forward that you will.


Kody Bateman: OK. So you’ve mentioned that all of these examples you’ve given is an accumulation of people that you send cards to on a daily basis and you mentioned in the pre-show that you would send on average 15 to 20 cards a day. So we can see why because you have a lot of people in your pipeline and you personally are following up with all these people the way you just described, to the tune of an average of 15 to 20 cards a day.


Now, again, to people listening, like how in the world would I ever send 15 – how much time does it take you to do that?


Jay McHugh: Less than 30 minutes and it’s because of systems. Once again, systems, meaning I check my send out. I get up early, 3:30, 4:30. Let the dogs out. I will put the coffee on for Stacey. Do my thing. Get on the treadmill and boom, I’m on SendOutCards looking at these great reminders that you have, birthdays and anniversaries. That could be two or three cards.


Then I look at my emails from the night before and I see who I’m in process with who needs a card. So I try to people I average between three and seven cards between 5:30 and 7:30. Easy.


Then again between 11:00 and 2:00 – people complain Kody and I get so annoyed with people and I say 86,400 freaking seconds in a day. Do not tell me you do not have time to send a card because if you’re not, your competition is thanking you.


So therefore I get out between another five and seven cards between 11:00 and 2 o’clock. Guess what happens in the afternoon. I get referrals. I get mortgage commitments. I get thank-yous. Oh, by the way, I got a call today before coming on to thank. Jay, want to go to the Bruins? Five rows from center ice. I think I will Kevin. Now Kevin is going to get a card from me saying thank you. He will get a card when we’re at the game, with a picture of him. We will probably get into a better box. Boom!


Then when I come home and I’m on the train, I go on to the commuter rail Wi-Fi and I send a few more cards, Kody. Simple.


Kody Bateman: So it’s a habit. It’s just a habit. It’s just something you do when you have the time and effort to do it. But accumulation, it only ends up being about 30 minutes a day and you’re getting all these cards out.


Let’s talk about cost. This is interesting. Let’s talk about cost. Fifteen to twenty cards a day. These are five by seven, full color, fully customized with pictures in them, customized message in them, customized with your signature on them, your branding on the back. You got one right there in front of you for our YouTube folks. He has got his branding on the back.


I mean, you know, all that stuff, you got to put a stamp on it. I mean a stamp is 50 cents. It’s going to go up to 55 cents here on January 27th. So this stamp alone, you got that and plus the cost of the card. Times 15 cards a day, I mean how much does it cost you to do this?


Jay McHugh: I love telling this to people. I say Kody loves me because I’m an advocate and I appreciate him and I sprinkle a lot of gifts and so forth. I look at it and I say it’s a fair trade. For someone to send out between 400 and 600 cards, it’s unbelievable that it would cost me $150 to $200 in the postage alone. I’m on a subscription with you for $147 a month and I find it criminal if real estate agents and loan professionals – because that’s my space – don’t have your system.


I tell people – you’ve heard me say this before. I love clichés. They work. It’s not the cost of sending the card folks. It’s the cost of not sending the card. That’s truly expensive.


2012, if I can continue. I got this email from my golf club and the golf club said that Mr. Mel is taking residence with his daughter. Here’s his new address. Nothing more, nothing less and I looked over to Stacey. I said, “Stacey, this is what Kody calls a prompting.” Back in 2012, guess what, apps were pretty new. She said, “Is that a new app?” I said, “No, no. Never mind, never mind.”


I put together a card saying, “Wishing you a great 2012, Mr. Mel. You’ve always been a great friend and mentor. The club indicated that you moved in with your daughter. Just wishing you a happy 2012.” Nothing more, nothing less.


When I tell this to real estate agents, they say, “Did you put a business card in it? Did you ask for the business?” and I said, “No, no. You’re missing the point. This was just an act of a prompting.”


Anyway, a week later, I get this email. Hi. This is Mrs. Smith. I want to protect your name. This is Mrs. Smith. We received your card and a box of brownies. Are you the Jay McHugh that sent this to my dad? If so or not, please let me know.


I looked over at Stacey and I said, “Stacey, what did I do wrong now? I’m always pushing the limits.” She said, “You’re overreacting Jay. Just email them back,” and again, back in the day, 2012 – we’re eight years, nine years forward, seven years forward, people can write things in an email that they don’t mean and vice versa. But I took it as I did something wrong. I overstepped my bounds.


So I wrote back to her. I said, “Yes. I played golf with your dad. It’s an [0:34:57] [Indiscernible] golf club and I used to bartend for him at [Indiscernible]. Now I have my appreciation parties there. I know it’s a new owner with Eddie. But I just want to reach out and wish him a great 2012.”


In a nanosecond, I get back this email. Jay, thanks very much for reaching out. I’m not sure you’re aware but my dad has Alzheimer’s and he won’t be coming to Dedham. We were hoping and wondering if you would help sell his house for us.


Kody Bateman: Wow, wow, wow, wow.


Jay McHugh: That also turned into seven more transactions, way over $100,000 in return.


Kody Bateman: Now that was early on when you started using the system, right? Wasn’t that back in like – what was the year that happened?


Jay McHugh: That was 2012. I was using the system since 2009.


Kody Bateman: OK.


Jay McHugh: And that was just another elevation of – here’s another thing I love to share with people. Back then, I was living 50 miles away from the subject house. I’ve been at the club less than three years and I was 42, 43 at the time and there were seven other agents that sell real estate locally and one of them asked me saying, “Jay, how do I know about that new listing you have coming on?” and I said, “That’s Mr. Mel’s house,” and he said, “I was going to send him a card. Don’t tell me you sent him a card.” I said, “I didn’t. I sent him a card and a box of brownies.” He said, “You are good, Jay,” and he hung up the phone on me.


My point is, is that if one of those other seven agents had sent the daughter a card, they might most likely have gotten the business because they played golf with Mr. Mel longer. They’re most likely closer to his age and I did not send it to get. I just sent it to give. You’re the man, Kody. You taught me that.


Kody Bateman: Well, let’s go back. We’ve got incredible stories by the way. I love listening to your stories. They’re always very inspirational. So let’s go back because I want to make sure our listeners can kind of – I don’t know if they fully comprehended what you said.


You’re on a subscription for $147 a month. You send 15 to 20 heartfelt cards a day, stamps included, and all of those are included with the $147 a month. Is that right?


Jay McHugh: One hundred percent correct.


Kody Bateman: Well, if you do the math on that, I mean the value proposition in this is – and that 147, it doesn’t just include those 15 to 20 cards. It also gives you 100 group sends a month where you can send a card out to 100 people. It then includes the cost of that too.


So here’s my point. My point is, is that there are services out there for people in business that are designed to help you create and curate relationship and that’s what the SendOutCards system is all about. It’s about helping you to act on your promptings, to reach out in kindness to other human beings and we are going to reward people that do a lot of that.


So all of the packaging that SendOutCards offers is – it’s the most cost-effective for those who are going to send cards. It might not be the most cost-effective for those that want to send one card. We might not be the lowest price in the world for just sending one card to somebody. But if you want to send cards like Jay McHugh, if you want to send multiple cards a day, especially multiple heartfelt cards a day, add some group sends in with it, and be a guy that in the real estate business is in the top one percent of the one percent, as far as effectiveness, for $147 a month – and you probably spend more than that because you do gifts and all kinds of stuff too.


But the value proposition, there are services out there that will reward you for doing the right things. SendOutCards is one of them and I just wanted to say that and again it’s probably one of the reasons why this is one of the biggest tools that you use.


Now let me ask you because it says here out of 476 agents, 78 of them use SendOutCards. So tell me a little bit about the 78 that use them versus the rest that don’t. I mean talk to us about that.


Jay McHugh: I love it. I’m very critical of myself. At times I want more and I demand more and there’s that old adage that if you have a big tanker, oil tanker in Boston Harbor, it takes a long time to have that turned around to get back out to sea. What has happened in our real estate space – and I won’t name names but we know who the gentleman is. He’s a great friend of mine. But he has put a virus in the mind that a handwritten personal note card is better than what SendOutCards is offering.


I just have to be careful of how I say it without having my agents walk out the door because I can be very intimidating. I’m learning on that. I’m learning on that and what I have decided to do is just prove it to them. You know, prove it to them.


Hey guys. Here’s another – I averaged last year 35 miles away from where I live my listings and people say, “That’s ridiculous.” I said, “Well, 100 percent of it was referral and that means that people aren’t afraid to refer me business. One-stop shop, one listing appointment, the right price, the right professional service fee. And guys, don’t you want that or do you want to chase leads?”


I have this number that I use all the time. I say, “Guys, if you’re worried about how much the cost of sending SendOutCards or the service of SendOutCards, you don’t realize that you’re paying 10X that.” What do you mean, Jay? I said, “Well, when you take a referral from one of these prolific lead generation companies and you’re paying 25 percent to 35 percent, just on a rough number, 10 grand for a commission. You average in that – this area. You’re netting 6500. That means you paid 3500 to a referral.” But I got the sale, Jay.


I said, “Listen to me. If you spent 3500 with me at SendOutCards, you will earn an additional 35,000, not 6500.” They just don’t believe it, Kody and that’s fine because you know who they are. They’re the Gails, the Bryans, the Chads, the Jays in our SendOutCards system who are just reaping great results. We keep adding great mortgage and loan officers and title and real estate agents and good for them. They’re the ones that are benefiting.


Kody Bateman: Yeah.


Jay McHugh: So I stopped complaining to myself as why people can’t see what we see and I just prove it and the best part is that I love saying to them, “Hey folks. If you don’t believe in it, can you give me five of your top agents that you’re competing against on listings?” Why would I want to do that, Jay? Well, I just want to call them and help them sign up for SendOutCards and when I prove it to our competition, maybe then you will see the light.


Kody Bateman: Yeah, that’s good stuff. So again, a lot of – results. I mean that’s what it all comes down to. Everybody is interested in results and so your 76 agents – I think it’s 76. Yeah, your 76 agents that use that service faithfully like their leader versus those who don’t. It all shows up in the results. It’s as simple as that. You’re enjoying 100 percent referral business and that’s a pretty big deal.


I mean we’ve had – some of our previous guests are in the sales space in the inside or outbound sales space. I used to talk to them about, “How does somebody in your sales funnel get to where they can generate 100 percent referral business?” and all of those guests have a very difficult time even comprehending a 100 percent referral sales business.


Traditional marketing, you can do a lot of right things to generate referral business and there’s a lot of tactics out there that try to force a referral, like asking for a referral every time you turn around kind of stuff. We don’t teach that. We don’t say ask for referral. We tell you deserve a referral. Appreciate people. What you appreciate appreciates.


So our philosophy is a little different. But I’ve had guest after guest after guest who faithfully use SendOutCards will come on here like you and say, “I’m enjoying today 100 percent referral business.” So that’s the results we’re talking about. I mean it’s incredible, incredible stuff.


Well Jay, look, we could go on all day long talking to you. You’ve got some amazing things. I want to – let’s do a little freelance just for a second. No questions, no nothing. I just want to – let’s turn it over to Jay McHugh. I want five minutes of Jay McHugh. Just talk to us about anything you want. You’re a strong student of personal development. You’re an amazing entrepreneurial story. You’re a great success. Give us five minutes of the infamous Jay McHugh. Go for it.


Jay McHugh: Well, one of the things that I’ve learned and I was very intimidate when I went to a SendOutCards convention and I saw all these great folks up on stage. I realized that if I’m going to get better, 10X better, I need to improve on my vernacular, my speech.


I might through the F-bomb around a little bit too much but that’s privately. But what I find and I teach my closest students, closest agents, if you’re going to compete against Jay or Paul or Nancy, our top agents, you better get your speech and your presentation down extremely well because that’s what most people are failing on.


Hey, I like you. I think you’re great. Everything is great. But then I got to tell you the real reason is that they don’t believe that you can get the result that you’re looking for.


Once you start to command that, then you’re much more comfortable by exposing SendOutCards and our relationship partners how this service will work. I get the biggest kick out of helping my sideline, upline, downline, no line. I have four, five calls. In fact, George, I’m going to be speaking with George this afternoon and Suzy tomorrow. They’re not part of my team. I love helping them because somebody stopped and helped me 10 years ago with SendOutCards.


The fact is, is that when you can sprinkle in this awesome tool of SendOutCards and you can master how to handle objections from my friend Grant Cardone, your business is just going to explode. I thank you from the bottom of my heart because you’ve introduced me to this. I may have already known it. But you’ve just accelerated it and I continue to thank my wife Stacey and the people who write blogs and Grant Cardone and I put it all together and I just say to myself, “This is awesome. I’m never going to be out of business. I can recruit 10 agents tomorrow if I needed to because I’ve got this unbelievable tool. I get 10 listings tomorrow because I can because I have this unbelievable tool.”


I wake up every morning knowing that I have a great business and it’s folks like you that I have to say thank you to and I’m here. I’m an open book. Anybody wants to contact me, they can. I’m happy to share this unbelievable tool, system, relationship and it’s just the world needs more of Kody Batemans and Jodi Batemans.


Kody Bateman: Well, hey, I appreciate that very much. Hey listen. So yeah, I’m going to do this on an ongoing podcast. I was actually on a call the other day with an associate of ours that we both know, George Redheffer. You remember George out of Arizona?


He’s going to be calling you. He’s going to be calling you. He has got a buddy of his that we’re working with and I actually referred them to speak to you because he wanted some examples of success for real estate people. So be expecting a call from George and – because I know that you just love to coach and teach people. So I feel like I can do that and I appreciate you taking care of people like you do.


Hey, you’ve got a – let’s see here. You got this little book here. For those on YouTube, I’m just holding up this Jay McHugh book, How to Sell Your Home for More Money. So there it is right there. Those on YouTube can see it.


By the way, this is kind of funny. So Super Dave, you know Dave Smith. He’s the producer of this show. So he’s doing all the background for the show right now. He and his wife are in the process of selling their home right now and it was the funniest thing because – you know, I got a million books I’m reading and what not. This book was sitting in a stack of books about a week ago. It just happened to come to the surface and like oh wow, yeah, I’m going to take this home.


So it’s a quick read. I’m not selling a home but I – you wrote it. So I’m going to read it. So I went home and read it.


Then I realized and like well, Dave has been trying to sell his house for quite a while now and they’re having a little bit of struggle. So the next day, I said, “Dave, did you know about Jay’s book?” So I hand him Jay’s book and he’s like, “You got to be kidding me! You got to be kidding me!”


Like he had just gone out and you talk about this in the book. You talk about – what do they call them? The people that help you out. What do they call that in here? Staging, staging people.


Jay McHugh: Yeah.


Kody Bateman: He had just gone out and gotten a staging person. I said, “Well, you got to read this book.” So anyway, I just thought that was really cool. So how do people get this?


Jay McHugh: They could just email me Kody at and then I can get them onboard and work on a price for them. No problem at all.


Kody Bateman: Yeah, super cool stuff, super cool stuff. All right. Well, Jay, listen. We appreciate you. We always like to close the show by asking a couple of the same questions that people – first of all, if you want to be – how do you most want to be remembered? How would you most like to be remembered after you pass on and while you continue to live here in this life? How does Jay McHugh want to be remembered?


Jay McHugh: I want to be remembered as a carer, a sharer, a giver, but also someone that, like you said, worked in the trenches. I don’t want anything given to me. I want to be able to fight and claw, be able to keep my head up high and to be able to give back as much as I can to those that are interested in learning. If I can do that, I will be very, very happy.


Kody Bateman: It’s funny. Jodi and I were listening – she found this new country song that Alan Jackson sings and it’s a new song. Alan Jackson is an old guy now but I guess he introduced a new song and ironically, the song is titled – he introduced it in October this year. The song is titled – oh, what’s – “The Older I Get”. So the song is titled “The Older I Get” and what he learns the older he gets.


There’s a line in there. There’s a line in the song that I thought was so powerful. He says, “The older I get, the more I know when to give and when not to give a damn.” The older I get, the more I know when to give and when not to give a damn. I don’t know why Jay but I thought of you when I heard that because you – that’s you. Like you give like – you’re an amazing giver and you also know when not to give a damn because you’re not afraid to express yourself, which I just love about you and people say stuff these days. People – social media is crazy. People say nasty things about people, stuff like that.


You got to know when to give and you got to know when not to give a damn. I’ve learned from you. I really have. I’ve learned that from you. I’ve watched you. I’ve watched how you’ve handled people and it’s just inspiring to me. I wish I could be more like that sometimes. So I’m learning from you as well. Favorite book –


Jay McHugh: I will leave you with this Kody because you bring up something good. My mom passed away early, my dad not too far after that. So it was tough coming from a big Irish family. But my mother used to say Irish diplomacy is telling a man to go to hell and they look forward to it.


Kody Bateman: That’s good. That is a great way to close the show everybody. So I appreciate it, Jay McHugh. What an honor it has been to have you on the show today. Thank you everybody for tuning in and please make sure you go to or go to anywhere – refer people to anywhere that you download a podcast and just look up the Relationship Marketing Show with Kody Bateman and make sure you get people here to listen to Jay’s message, his special message that he has for us today. So thanks everybody. We will see you next time. Take care now.


Jay McHugh: Bye-bye now.

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If you would like to learn more about how to incorporate a Relationship Marketing Strategy in your business, feel free to call or text me at {LEAD_OWNER_PHONE|}I Will answer all your questions and help you build relationships, increase referrals, and make an amazing impression on all your clients, friends and family!

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